[KS] Variable Romanization of 년(年) in McCune-Reischauer

[Werner Sasse]

Dear Otfried,
thanks for your answers, which I think are telling me what my experience also makes me see (sorry: hear}

.> One of the speakers on those tapes systematically pronounced 외 as /ö/ 
> and 위 as /ü/.   If I remember right, the textbook explained that this 
> pronunciation was a valid variant used by some speakers.
Does this not smack of being prescriptive? 

> I have met two (unrelated) senior Professor Choi's, who both told me 
> that their name is properly pronounced /chö/, even though they did not 
> seem to use the /ö/ variant in their own speech.
That is exactly  my experience. Talking about speaking <=> speaking...


> Samuel Martin's "A reference grammar of Korean" (my copy was published 
> in 1992) describes /외/ on page 24 as the front rounded mid vowel, that 
> is /ö/.  However, he says that "in standard Seoul speech 외 is not 
> distinguished from 웨", and "many speakers tend to pronounce 위 as a 
> long monophthong /ü/ rather than the more common diphthong".
Now this difference in  /ü/ vs. /ö/ is really interesting and I agree, although the  /ü/ in 
my ear still has some, almost not easy to hear /i/. And the /i/ is another variant you
can hear in a number of combinations...

> When I point out to them that adding 이 to 아 and 어 moves the vowel 
> from the back to the front of the mouth, and that the logical 
> generalization would be for 외 and 위 to be fronted 오 and 우's, they 
> agree (with surprise) that Hangul is inconsistent - but they still can't 
> accept the variant as correct Korean, or think of anyone who speaks like 
> that.
Now here we have an interesting remark, to which I cannot give a sound answer, as I am 
traveling and do not have my library and my notes with me. But what may look inconsistent today, 
may not have been inconsistent when the King made the alphabet with his friends 
Just some hints:
1) adding /i/ was an off-glide, and still today sijo-singers pronounce 애 as /a-i/, and so on... I 
I would have to look up when exactly the different monophthongisations took place
2) I have not followed this up, but the question, when 어 changed from /e/ to /ŏ/ until recently
 was not yet settled, with most Korean colleagues giving a to early date (my date has to do with 
the transcription of Mongolian /e/ as /어/ in early Korean textbooks. 

A final remark: what do scholars who work on dialects have to say in this respect?

Best wishes
Your Werner

> Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2014 15:56:36 +0900
> From: otfried at airpost.net
> To: koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com
> Subject: Re: [KS] Variable Romanization of 년(年) in McCune-Reischauer
> 
> 
> 
> On 24/02/14 13:38, Werner Sasse wrote:
> > Right you are. Reminds me of Korean scholars in "Germanistik", who try
> > to convince me that Korean 외 is identical with German /ö/ : The
> > linguist's need or wish to make a rule, which sometimes is overriding
> > simple observation, a not uncommon occupational disease amongst us
> > scholars (and not only linguists)
> 
> I have been wondering about this for a long time.  When I first learnt 
> Korean,  I had some tapes that turned out to have been recorded a long 
> time ago, possibly in the 1950's (with example sentences like "This 
> towel costs 23 Won").
> 
> One of the speakers on those tapes systematically pronounced 외 as /ö/ 
> and 위 as /ü/.   If I remember right, the textbook explained that this 
> pronunciation was a valid variant used by some speakers.
> 
> I have met two (unrelated) senior Professor Choi's, who both told me 
> that their name is properly pronounced /chö/, even though they did not 
> seem to use the /ö/ variant in their own speech.
> 
> Samuel Martin's "A reference grammar of Korean" (my copy was published 
> in 1992) describes /외/ on page 24 as the front rounded mid vowel, that 
> is /ö/.  However, he says that "in standard Seoul speech 외 is not 
> distinguished from 웨", and "many speakers tend to pronounce 위 as a 
> long monophthong /ü/ rather than the more common diphthong".
> 
> I personally do not remember meeting a Korean who used the monophthong 
> variants, and when I ask younger Koreans about this, they are completely 
> baffled.  They never heard about this variant, and have no idea why 
> Goethe is spelled 괴테.
> 
> When I point out to them that adding 이 to 아 and 어 moves the vowel 
> from the back to the front of the mouth, and that the logical 
> generalization would be for 외 and 위 to be fronted 오 and 우's, they 
> agree (with surprise) that Hangul is inconsistent - but they still can't 
> accept the variant as correct Korean, or think of anyone who speaks like 
> that.
> 
> When did this variant fall out of usage?  Or has it always been a 
> regional variant?  Is it still alive somewhere?
> 
> Best wishes,
>   Otfried Cheong
> 
> 
> 
> 
 		 	   		  
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