[KS] "Petition; "Make U.S. high school curriculums more inclusive of Japanese War Crimes during WW II"

Fri Feb 7 08:34:46 EST 2014

Dear Bill Streifer,

A woman who spent her childhood in an Indonesian concentration camp managed
by Japanese told me that the workers of the camp (not the prisoners, in
this case) were Koreans. The manager of the camp was Japanese.

As I learned at my Jewish Orthodox school in Gush Ezion, Israel, the Nazist
treatment of Jews included complex relationship with the Jewish leadership.
There was this famous case of one of Jewish ghettos in Europe, where the
leader of Jewish community first supplied to Nazis goods made at the ghetto
factory, then labor force, then a certain number of people, then children.
The rest of the ghetto people included the leaders were killed by Nazist
just a few weeks before liberation.

My specialization is 'technologies of self'. Technologies of self includes
how to build a person, and how to break a person. Nazist, communist and
similar regimes have a particular set of skills and techniques, that
include moral/spiritual demoralization, humiliation and elimination. You
can apply these techniques to a person, and also to a nation.

Victoria Ten
Leiden University
On Feb 7, 2014 2:12 AM, <koreanstudies-request at koreanstudies.com> wrote:

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> <<------------ KoreanStudies mailing list DIGEST ------------>>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Pyongyang Univ of Science & Tech (PUST) on BBC1 TV, Mon 3
>       Feb, 2030 ... (Gianluca Spezza)
>    2. Re: Pyongyang Univ of Science & Tech (PUST) on BBC1 TV,   Mon 3
>       Feb, 2030 ... (Afostercarter at aol.com)
>    3. Re: Koreanstudies Digest, Vol 128, Issue 6 (Bill Streifer)
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Gianluca Spezza <spezzagianluca at gmail.com>
> To: koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com
> Cc:
> Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2014 16:54:46 +0200
> Subject: Re: [KS] Pyongyang Univ of Science & Tech (PUST) on BBC1 TV, Mon
> 3 Feb, 2030 ...
>  yes Nicholas,
>
> actually no need to believe it. it's a fact the KPA is involved in PUST.
> they built it from scratch, they run most of the facilities if not all of
> them, they do the maintenance, they send some of their children there
> (others go to a couple of special military institutions in PY, pretty much
> as well equipped as PUST), and given that every single bit of educational
> material is scrupulously checked before it reaches the classrom, we know
> this is also done by part of the military.
>
> I agree with Caroline that some of the questions in the doc were a bit
> dumb (seriously, michael jackson ...of all people?) but then again that is
> BBC panorama. They do have the urgency to proclaim they found some
> 'incredible story' behind everything, like the students going to the 'juche
> building' to receive classes in politics, ideology and history. that has
> been happening since 1948 in NK, in every school, not much news there. Also
> such practice is one of the pillars on which Dr. James Kim built his
> agreement with the NK government (just as he did in China for YUST): zero
> interference with politics/absolute lip service to the ruling government,
> and it could not be otherwise or the school would have never seen the
> light.
>
> However, this works for non-sensitive subjects, such as computer science,
> agriculture or chemistry, it is clear that students remain behind on many
> important topics: economy, private finance, individual rights, history,
> media, and this all makes their education less valuable (some say useless)
> outside of North Korea.
>
> The real question for me is how long can PUST continue to teach in such a
> sealed-off environment and is it really worth it in terms of 'positive
> change for the future of North Korea and its integration with the rest of
> the world'?
>
> We'll probably see very skilled agronomists and statisticians in NK in the
> next years , who still won't know how life really goes on outside of their
> country. What's the point?
>
> Last, one question i would have liked to ask (but I know it can't be
> asked, even  off the record) is: do students at PUST know about how the
> university came about, who funds it and who founded it and what is the
> story behind the Christian foundation that owns and runs PUST and YUST)?
>
> I know the answer is 'no' (and this has been confirmed by all the
> PUST-related people i have interviewed), because it would be very hard to
> explain the that their government allowed a religious foundation, with HQs
> in US and SK to run one of the top schools in the country.
>
> Cheers
>
> G. Spezza - NK News
>
> On 06/02/14 15:35, levi nicolas wrote:
>
>  I'm probably feeling more depressed than Frank Hoffman.
>
>  I also do believe that the KPA is involved in the management of the
> PUST.
>
>   ------------------------------
>  *De :* Caroline Norma <cazzpeta at hotmail.com> <cazzpeta at hotmail.com>
> *À :* Korean Studies Discussion List <koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com><koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com>
> *Envoyé le :* Jeudi 6 février 2014 14h24
> *Objet :* Re: [KS] Pyongyang Univ of Science & Tech (PUST) on BBC1 TV,
> Mon 3 Feb, 2030 ...
>
>  Yes, a truly awful documentary, but the scene where the student points
> out the factory owner would have to give up ownership, and that was the
> 'problem' with the task assigned, was at least one bright moment. And how
> appropriate that the presenter asked the class whether they knew who
> Michael Jackson was--the biggest symbol of decadent, paedophilic, drugged
> up western social decline anyone could think of. It was almost a relief
> they had no idea.
> Many thanks for forwarding the link.
> Caroline Norma
>
>  > Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2014 10:21:55 -0800
> > From: hoffmann at koreanstudies.com
> > To: koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com
> > Subject: Re: [KS] Pyongyang Univ of Science & Tech (PUST) on BBC1 TV,
> Mon 3 Feb, 2030 ...
> >
> > Dear Aidan -- sure, can amplify and magnify, quantify and objectify,
> > but it shall just be another stultifying experience. That is not needed.
> >
> > Frank
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, 5 Feb 2014 09:47:50 -0500 (EST), Afostercarter at aol.com wrote:
> > > Frank, this has to be your shortest post ever.
> > > Care to amplify?
> > >
> > > Best
> > > Aidan
> > >
> > > __________________
> > >
> > > In a message dated 05/02/2014 12:34:30 GMT Standard Time,
> > > hoffmann at koreanstudies.com writes:
> > >>
> > >> How depressing.
> > >>
> > >> Regards,
> > >> Frank
> > >>
> > >>
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Afostercarter at aol.com
> To: koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com
> Cc: baks at jiscmail.ac.uk
> Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 09:05:12 -0500 (EST)
> Subject: Re: [KS] Pyongyang Univ of Science & Tech (PUST) on BBC1 TV, Mon
> 3 Feb, 2030 ...
>  So already a fruitful debate begins. I hope it continues.
>
> I was curious as to what in particular had depressed Frank.
> The BBC programme? Or PUST itself? Or both?
> Others' responses so far vary on this point.
>
> For my part, I'm not entirely depressed about either.
> It seems to me a net gain, and amazing, that PUST exists at all.
>
> As for the programme could have been worse (Sweeney!)
> - though also much better. *Why on earth did no one ask*
> *why the students are all male?*
>
> And while I'm being a big softie, imho Caroline is a bit
> hard on the late great sad MJ: also a victim. But she
> has the DPRK's British fan-club on her side:
>
> http://juche007-anglo-peopleskoreafriendship.blogspot.co.uk/2014/02/old-and-new-lies-bbc-panorma-educating.html
>
>
> *... the people of the DPRK are better off without the degenerate *
>
> *whooping  and screeching sounds of Michael Jackson!*
>
> Cheers
> Aidan FC
>
>
> _________________________
>
>  In a message dated 06/02/2014 13:39:49 GMT Standard Time,
> nicolas_levi at yahoo.fr writes:
>
>  I'm probably feeling more depressed than Frank Hoffman.
>
> I also do believe that the KPA is involved in the management of the PUST.
>
>   ------------------------------
> *De :* Caroline Norma <cazzpeta at hotmail.com>
> *À :* Korean Studies Discussion List <koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com>
> *Envoyé le :* Jeudi 6 février 2014 14h24
> *Objet :* Re: [KS] Pyongyang Univ of Science & Tech (PUST) on BBC1 TV,
> Mon 3 Feb, 2030 ...
>
>  Yes, a truly awful documentary, but the scene where the student points
> out the factory owner would have to give up ownership, and that was the
> 'problem' with the task assigned, was at least one bright moment. And how
> appropriate that the presenter asked the class whether they knew who
> Michael Jackson was--the biggest symbol of decadent, paedophilic, drugged
> up western social decline anyone could think of. It was almost a relief
> they had no idea.
> Many thanks for forwarding the link.
> Caroline Norma
>
>  > Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2014 10:21:55 -0800
> > From: hoffmann at koreanstudies.com
> > To: koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com
> > Subject: Re: [KS] Pyongyang Univ of Science & Tech (PUST) on BBC1 TV,
> Mon 3 Feb, 2030 ...
> >
> > Dear Aidan -- sure, can amplify and magnify, quantify and objectify,
> > but it shall just be another stultifying experience. That is not needed.
> >
> > Frank
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, 5 Feb 2014 09:47:50 -0500 (EST), Afostercarter at aol.com wrote:
> > > Frank, this has to be your shortest post ever.
> > > Care to amplify?
> > >
> > > Best
> > > Aidan
> > >
> > > __________________
> > >
> > > In a message dated 05/02/2014 12:34:30 GMT Standard Time,
> > > hoffmann at koreanstudies.com writes:
> > >>
> > >> How depressing.
> > >>
> > >> Regards,
> > >> Frank
> > >>
> > >>
> >
>
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Bill Streifer <photografr7 at yahoo.com>
> To: "koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com" <koreanstudies at koreanstudies.com>
> Cc:
> Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2014 14:56:00 -0800 (PST)
> Subject: Re: [KS] Koreanstudies Digest, Vol 128, Issue 6
> Saying the Japanese forced Koreans to do the "dirty work" at camps is like
> saying the Nazis were "mean" to the Jews. Having studied the specific
> atrocities perpetrated by the Japanese on British POWs at a camp at Konan,
>  Korea during WWII (including beheadings, beatings and starvation), I can
> assure you that the treatment of Koreans by the Japanese was far worse than
> doing the dishes. By the way, I obtained my information from the children
> of former British and Australian POWs as well the official written
> statements of survivors. So before you begin thinking of adding the
> Japanese mistreatment of Koreans to school textbooks, you had better
> understand the full-extent and types of atrocities involved.
>
> - Bill Streifer
>
>
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