[KS] Dear Leader

[Jim Hoare]

Dear all

 

I am not sure that I have seen all the correspondence on this issue, so
forgive me if I repeat what other's have said.

Commemorative plaques marking visits by the 'Dear Leader' are still to be
found all over the DPRK, and the title had not fallen into disuse in 2001-2,
although it was beginning to be replaced by Dear General or just Our
General. That said, I think that Ruediger is right and that Chairman is
accurate and neutral. There is an element of mockery in the way that
journalists and even some scholars continue to use the Dear Leader tag.

I do not recollect anybody translating the choson rodongtang as anything but
Korea Workers' Party,and this seems to be the DPRK preference. But since
labour is a collective noun for workers, it could be equally be the Korean
Labour Party.

 

Best wishes

 

Jim Hoare 

 

  _____  

From: koreanstudies-bounces at koreaweb.ws
[mailto:koreanstudies-bounces at koreaweb.ws] On Behalf Of Ruediger_Frank
Sent: 04 October 2006 09:11
To: Korean Studies Discussion List
Subject: Re: [KS] Dear Leader

 

Dear all,

 

as Aidan knows from many related debates we had, the title of Kim Jong-il is
one of the issues that bothers me a lot. Actually, it is not the title
itself, but how it is used in Western media. Kim JI has been the Dear Leader
(jinaehaneun jidoja) until his father's death, which is long enough ago to
just forget about that title. Ever since, his functionary titles
(chongbiseo, wiwonjang etc.) aside, he is referred to as Great Leader
(widaehan ryeongdoja) or, less frequently, Dear General (jinaehaneun
janggunnim). We outsiders seem to like the somewhat funny expression "Dear
Leader", so it has survived in our media. So far, so good,  but imho at
least academics should use the correct title, no matter what they personally
think about the man. It is certainly problematic that in English, widehan
suryeongnim and widehan ryeongdoja are both translated as Great Leader;
however, I am wondering why there would be too many instances to use these
honorific titles anyway (imagine the NYT or Washington Post using "Great
Leader"). The official address in international protocol is Chairman
(wiwonjang), which is both correct and fairly neutral. As for the Worker's
Party, it should be mentioned that "Labour Party" (instead of Labourer's
Party) would indeed be the correct translation; it is not rodongjadang, but
rodongdang. But I guess that would make our British colleagues unhappy...

 

Best,

 

Ruediger Frank


PS: For those who might think these are just words, here is what Confucius
had to say (Lun-yu, Chapter 13, Verse 3): 

"If terminology is not corrected, then what is said cannot be followed. If
what is said cannot be followed, then work cannot be accomplished. If work
cannot be accomplished, then ritual and music cannot be developed. If ritual
and music cannot be developed, then criminal punishments will not be
appropriate. If criminal punishments are not appropriate, the people cannot
make a move. Therefore, the Superior Man needs to have his terminology
applicable to real language, and his speech must accord with his actions.
The speech of the Superior Man cannot be indefinite."

(http://www.human.toyogakuen-u.ac.jp/~acmuller/contao/analects.htm)

 

 

am Mittwoch, 04. Oktober 2006 um 03:10 schrieben Sie:

 

> Dear Andriy & Michael

 

> "Suryo^ng-nim" is just "leader". "Dear leader" is a usual English

> rendering of "Chin'aeha'nu^n chidoja" and is a standard epithet for

> Kim Cho^ng-il.  Kim's father was known, inter alia, as

> "kyo^ng'aeha'nu^n suryo^ng-nim," another epithet standardly rendered

> in English as "Respected and Beloved Leader."  The

> "Nodongdang"/"Rodongdang") is translated regularly as the "[Korean]

> Workers Party," in English and is often abbrievated KWP.  Kim

> Cho^ng-il is the General Secretary ("Ch'ong Piso^.")

 

> Doc Rock

 

> Andriy Ryzhkov < <mailto:andy_kim at ukr.net> andy_kim at ukr.net> wrote: Dear
Michael, 

> "Dear leader" sounds like "suryong-nim" in Korean and is still used to
address Kim Jeon Il,

> but this term is used mostly in North Korea (he may also be called

> "Kim Jeong Il rodong-dang piseo" which means "The secretary of

> labour party", which is more official, but I`m not sure about the

> correctness of this term).  In "suryong-nim" "suryong" is

> Sino-Korean word which stands for "the leader" and "~nim" is a

> honorific suffix of pure Korean origin. As for South Korea, he is

> usually called "Kim Jeong Il gugpang wiweon-jang" or "chairman of National
defence committee".

> I`m not sure whether my reply is satisfactory...

> Best regards, 

> Ryzhkov Andriy, 

> PhD candidate

> National Taras Shevchenko university of Kyiv.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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> Dr. Edward D. Rockstein 

> Korean Language Instructor 

> Language Learning Center (LLC) 

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nothing. "

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> Edmund Burke

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